Disputing Baliff Fees

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Lyndskg
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Joined: 17 May 2017 10:12

#1 Disputing Baliff Fees

Post by Lyndskg » 17 May 2017 11:05

Morning,

I will try and keep this brief. I am currently fighting the fees a
Enforcement office is charging us.

Back in 2016 I owed some outstanding childcare fees. To cut a very long story short we didn't agree with the fees and refused to pay the amount until the bill was corrected. This ended up in the owner of the nursery
taking court action again us. Looking back I do wish I had just paid the fees and disputed the amount after but we struggle to make ends meet anyway and did not have the money to pay this back in full at the time. We paid
the judgement debt back in 2016 and now the enforcement office is chasing us for their fees which are a whopping £3600. Making the debt over £5000.

After doing some research I asked them to send me a breakdown of costs and any receipts to back these stages up.

I did get sent a breakdown of fees but no receipts:


FEE BREAKDOWN YOU SENT US:

Judgment Debt £3,242.79

Judgment Costs £307.00

Credits £0.00

Execution Costs £111.75

Interest charged to date £282.49

Daily interest charge £0.80



Date Name Amount

07-03-2016 Compliance Stage Fee £75.00

05-04-2016 *First Enforcement Stage Fee £398.00

13-04-2016 *Second Enforcement Stage Fee £495.00

15-04-2016 *Sale or Disposal Stage Fee £801.00

Total VAT 353.80

We paid the nursery debt of £2600 back in May 2016 and since this breakdown we have paid the judgement costs, the first, second and third stage of baliff action.

We have now sent a complaint letter to the baliff company asking them to look at and correct any fees that are wrong. Which they are refusing to do, saying they are correct and sending someone to collect goods from my house.

I have worked out that the first stage fee is calculated wrong and I also didn't think the baliff company could charge VAT if the 'Creditor' is VAT
registered? Or am I wrong?

Also I have since found out that the Writ of control expired 15th March 2017. Does this mean they have no legal right to come to our house and take goods? If they did turn up and the Writ has expired what rights do they
have to enforce this action?

Any help and legal advise would be much appreciated as I want to know where I stand with this now and if I need to pay anything I haven't already.

Thanks you

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jasonDWB
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#2 Re: Disputing Baliff Fees

Post by jasonDWB » 17 May 2017 13:45

If the creditor is VAT registered, then the creditor reclaims the VAT element of the fees. When the bailiff charges the VAT to the debtor as well, then he is receiving the VAT twice. You can reclaim it by bringing a court action in the small claims track and give the HMRC advisory in evidence.

I wouldn't complain to the bailiff company or any other company. They will mess you about. Just take the shortest route to remedy the problem.

Once the writ has lapsed 6 years, it becomes unenforceable, section 24 of the Limitation Act 1980.

When the judgment debt was paid, and provided the bailiff did not take and sell any goods, the enforcement power ceases under paragraph 6 (3) (a) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act 2007.

If you paid the bailiffs fees in May 2016, you might well have some redress if the enforcement action is not compliant. Here is a checklist:

http://beatthebailiffs.org/Stop-a-high- ... ficer.html
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Lyndskg
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Joined: 17 May 2017 10:12

#3 Re: Disputing Baliff Fees

Post by Lyndskg » 17 May 2017 16:18

Thank you for your reply.

We paid the nursery fees we owed in May 2016 and paid the enforcement stage fees about a month ago.

Looking at the breakdown of fees is there any other cost we are meant to have paid?

No one has even been in our house/no goods taken.

We have paid a total of £2600 in 2016 + £1235.21 in 2017.

Is there anyway I can find out if the nursery is VAT registered?

So if the enforcement has ceased as we have paid back the judgement debt does this mean they can't come knocking at our door legally? They have been phoning us everyday, twice a day from diverted numbers and threatening that someone is coming to our house and can take what the want and there is nothing that we can do about it.

They have also refused to show receipt for the other fees they are trying to charge us.

Could I also ask what execution costs are?

Many thanks

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jasonDWB
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#4 Re: Disputing Baliff Fees

Post by jasonDWB » 17 May 2017 16:41

Ring them up and ask for their VAT number, if there is none then there is no VAT.

VAT only applies to the costs of taking control of goods. It doesn't apply to "fees", and you can reclaim them in the small claims track from the creditor.

The execution costs is a two part statutory charge. Half of it is the transfer up application fee and the other is the court fee. The bailiff and creditor do not gain anything from it. They stand to lose that money if the writ is never paid.

If the bailiff is pestering you about fees, then consider having a detailed assessment hearing. You need an expert to help you, but this article gives a skeleton of the procedure. http://www.dealingwithbailiffs.co.uk/da.html I always use solicitors for this because the creditor ends up paying their fees.


If the disputed fees of costs are not in the remit of a detailed assessment hearing, then I reclaim them in the small claims track.
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Lyndskg
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#5 Re: Disputing Baliff Fees

Post by Lyndskg » 18 May 2017 17:23

Hi Jason,

I have since taken my case to court for a detailed assessment of fees.

I am disputing the Interest charged, the Sale and Disposel stage fee of £801, the VAT and the other fee totalling £2300 still.

I have had notice that this is going to a hearing and want to be totally prepared.

I am currently preparing another supporting document where I show I have also been charged a card fee and I have done a search for the company on FCA and there are no search result showing.

Could I also ask if the enforcement office posted a letter through our door does this automatically incur the Sale and Disposel fee or does this only kick in if they get in and take goods.

Many thanks

Lyndskg

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jasonDWB
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#6 Re: Disputing Baliff Fees

Post by jasonDWB » 18 May 2017 18:05

I have not seen your detailed assessment witness statement, so its difficult for me to advise. Drafting detailed assessments is not a service offered for free. Costs are recovered from the other side. I only give free guidance on it.

Posting a letter does not attract the sale stage fee. That only has effect AFTER the bailiff has taken control of goods in the meaning of one of the four steps prescribed in paragraph 13 (1) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act 2007. AND, the bailiff must start the process of removing the controlled goods to the place of sale (not the place of storage).

For the definitive guide, the law is regulation 5(1)(c) of the Taking Control of Goods (Fees) Regulations 2014, which states:

  • the sale or disposal stage, which comprises all activities relating to enforcement from the first attendance at the property for the purpose of transporting goods to the place of sale, or from commencing preparation for sale if the sale is to be held on the premises, until the completion of the sale or disposal (including application of the proceeds and provision of the information required by regulation 14).
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Lyndskg
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#7 Re: Disputing Baliff Fees

Post by Lyndskg » 18 May 2017 19:22

Hi Jason,

Please can you tell me how much it would cost for me to get this advise and detailed assessment done with you?

Many thanks

Lyndsey

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jasonDWB
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#8 Re: Disputing Baliff Fees

Post by jasonDWB » 19 May 2017 19:59

I'll speak with you tomorrow. Been out of action today.
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