Phoenix

Quash the Liability Order. Suspend Enforcement. Disputing Liabilities. Claim Damages for Misuse of Enforcement Power.
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TGK
Posts: 6
Joined: 13 Dec 2017 18:13

#1 Phoenix

Post by TGK » 13 Dec 2017 19:22

Today I received a visit from two HCE's from a firm called Phoenix. They said I was £367 in arrears with my council tax and that, with enforcement costs
I owed them £687. I said I didn't have that much money as I am unemployed and on Job Seekers Allowance. They said they would call for a van to take my stuff and clamp my £400 car. I said that if I'd know about the debt I would have dealt with it. They said that letters have been sent. I never received anything as ?councit tax has been paid from my benefits.

I was really frightened so I went into my home and emptied all my savings and with the money I'd put aside for the rent I paid them the rest by debit card. I have no paperwork as to what I was paying or why. I have a simple receipt with my name, the amount and reference numbers.

Any ideas as to how I can get some/all my money back.

Many thanks to anyone who can help

TGK

John The Baptist
Posts: 354
Joined: 06 Jun 2017 17:22

#2 Re: Phoenix

Post by John The Baptist » 13 Dec 2017 20:09

TGK wrote:
13 Dec 2017 19:22
Today I received a visit from two HCE's from a firm called Phoenix. They said I was £367 in arrears with my council tax and that, with enforcement costs
I owed them £687. I said I didn't have that much money as I am unemployed and on Job Seekers Allowance. They said they would call for a van to take my stuff and clamp my £400 car. I said that if I'd know about the debt I would have dealt with it. They said that letters have been sent. I never received anything as ?councit tax has been paid from my benefits.

I was really frightened so I went into my home and emptied all my savings and with the money I'd put aside for the rent I paid them the rest by debit card. I have no paperwork as to what I was paying or why. I have a simple receipt with my name, the amount and reference numbers.

Any ideas as to how I can get some/all my money back.

Many thanks to anyone who can help

TGK
Difficult now that you've paid.

You can write to the recovery manager at the council and ask if a letter was sent to you after a liability order was obtained and see what they say.

Bear in mind that you should receive a summons, a letter after the liability order was obtained and then a notice of enforcement from Phoenix. It is highly unlikely that all 3 letters went missing. Did you receive any of them? If not, ask the council what address they were using for correspondence.

TGK
Posts: 6
Joined: 13 Dec 2017 18:13

#3 Re: Phoenix

Post by TGK » 13 Dec 2017 20:25

I have never received any of the above letters. I've read some other threads and will try for a charge back from the bank or, failing that, issue a ccj unless anyone has a better idea.

Anything gratefully received.

John The Baptist
Posts: 354
Joined: 06 Jun 2017 17:22

#4 Re: Phoenix

Post by John The Baptist » 13 Dec 2017 20:29

TGK wrote:
13 Dec 2017 20:25
I have never received any of the above letters. I've read some other threads and will try for a charge back from the bank or, failing that, issue a ccj unless anyone has a better idea.

Anything gratefully received.
Obviously, a charge back will render your car at risk if successful.

As I said, you need to find out where the 3 letters were sent.

TGK
Posts: 6
Joined: 13 Dec 2017 18:13

#5 Re: Phoenix

Post by TGK » 13 Dec 2017 20:31

OK, will find out in the morning about the letters. Don't understand why my car is at risk?

John The Baptist
Posts: 354
Joined: 06 Jun 2017 17:22

#6 Re: Phoenix

Post by John The Baptist » 13 Dec 2017 21:47

Because they have already identified it.

If you manage to cancel the payment, they will go straight for your car - Wouldn't you if someone did a charge back on you?

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Schedule 12
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#7 Re: Phoenix

Post by Schedule 12 » 14 Dec 2017 00:22

TGK wrote:
13 Dec 2017 19:22

I owed them £687. I said I didn't have that much money as I am unemployed and on Job Seekers Allowance.
This won't get you off the council tax, but the £310 fees they hit you with might be recoverable. If you do a chargeback, then you must pay the council tax direct to the council and notify the bailiff. That places the bailiff at risk if he takes an enforcement step after you pay the amount outstanding.


Being unemployed puts you in a class of vulnerable people for civil enforcement. Regulation 12 of the Taking Control of Goods (Fees) Regulations 2014 states:
  • Recovery of fees from vulnerable debtors

    12. Where the debtor is a vulnerable person, the fee or fees due for the enforcement stage (or, where regulation 6 applies, the first, or first and second, enforcement stages as appropriate) and any disbursements related to that stage (or stages) are not recoverable unless the enforcement agent has, before proceeding to remove goods which have been taken into control, given the debtor an adequate opportunity to get assistance and advice in relation to the exercise of the enforcement power.




The bailiff may not take control of goods of lone vulnerable people, so clamping your car might be risky for the bailiff if you are alone and you catch him. Regulation 10(1) of the Taking Control of Goods Regulations 2013 states:


  • 10.—(1) The enforcement agent may not take control of goods of the debtor where—

    (a)the debtor is a child;

    (b)a child or vulnerable person (whether more than one or a combination of both) is the only person present in the relevant or specified premises in which the goods are located; or

    (c)the goods are also premises in which a child or vulnerable person (whether more than one or a combination of both) is the only person present.
That doesn't mean your car is safe, but it could save £310 of your JSA.
Run this Checklist. If no joy, then we'll fix it
Author: dealingwithbailiffs.co.uk

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