Did bailiff act illegally

Stop or Suspend Enforcement. Appeal the PCN. Claim Damages for Unlawful Interference with Vehicles.
Post Reply
waynehoward
Posts: 6
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 12:34

#1 Did bailiff act illegally

Post by waynehoward » 11 Jun 2015 12:48

Hi

A bailiff called for a PCN. As I understand it reading the pages of this site he acted illegally due to the following

He called without any prior notice, despite my complaints he said complain to the post office
The letter he left stated previous calls there had been none
He clamped my business van and said the van was worth £1200 and would be going to storage along with the stock inside, I am a market trader.
The van also has three items that did not belong to me which I had to deliver
The stock inside the van was around £2000 worth

I felt intimidated and if I didnt raise the cash in full the van would be removed which would put me out of business

I said I didnt think you could take a works van he said he could because it was not sign written, i explained I didnt want people knowing what was inside for security reasons

He told me the council stated just go and clamp the van and take it

I didnt want to sign anything but he said he couldnt release the clamp without me signing the receipt for the money and the van would have to go

He stated he had every legal right to take the van and the goods and I felt that the law was on his side

Can I take action against the bailiff with the Police and is there any action I can take to turn this over in court

He attended May 11th

I have telephoned a couple of help lines who were not very helpful, the info on this site has opened my eyes

I am a small trader on a government start up loan I cant afford to lose this money I am already struggling any help would be appreciated

thanks

User avatar
Schedule 12
Posts: 13471
Joined: 30 Jul 2012 21:23
Location: Philippines
Contact:

#2 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by Schedule 12 » 11 Jun 2015 17:14

waynehoward wrote:Hi

A bailiff called for a PCN. As I understand it reading the pages of this site he acted illegally due to the following

He called without any prior notice, despite my complaints he said complain to the post office
Ask the bailiff to give a tracking number then you will contact the post office. Otherwise an absent tracking number is evidence you have not been given a notice of enforcement.


waynehoward wrote: The letter he left stated previous calls there had been none
It's a standard Marston'esque letter bailiffs put through the door.


waynehoward wrote:
He clamped my business van and said the van was worth £1200 and would be going to storage along with the stock inside, I am a market trader.
The van is entirely exempt. One hapless bailiff company has learned that lesson the expensive way. Regulation 4 of the TCGR's 2013.

waynehoward wrote:
The van also has three items that did not belong to me which I had to deliver
The stock inside the van was around £2000 worth


The owner of the goods will have to report the goods stolen to the police and make an insurance claim, then make a Part 85 interpleader claim. He can recover them from the council under section 3 of the Torts (Interference with Goods) Act 1977 being a cheaper option.




waynehoward wrote:
I felt intimidated and if I didnt raise the cash in full the van would be removed which would put me out of business
The council would be liable for everything you lose, including all your earnings. A very big bill for a bailiff choosing to raik taking a trade vehicle.


waynehoward wrote: I said I didnt think you could take a works van he said he could because it was not sign written, i explained I didnt want people knowing what was inside for security reasons
Insurance and sign writing on trade vehicles is bailiff mythology. Nothing in regulations about insurance and sign writing.

waynehoward wrote: He told me the council stated just go and clamp the van and take it
Contact the council and see if the bailiff has lied to you, and add to your claim particulars to discredit the councils enforcement agent. The council may well pull their enforcement contract.



waynehoward wrote: I didnt want to sign anything but he said he couldnt release the clamp without me signing the receipt for the money and the van would have to go

He stated he had every legal right to take the van and the goods and I felt that the law was on his side

Can I take action against the bailiff with the Police and is there any action I can take to turn this over in court
The police will say it's a civil matter, but its actually an offence under the Fraud Act so you might be better to lay a complaint before a Clerk to the Justices under section 1 of the Magistrates Courts Act 1980. The Clerk can have the magistrate's order the police to arrest the bailiff and make an investigation, then bring the suspect before the court. The council will be asked to give a statement confirming they instructed the enforcement agent.

You can bring your own redress in a county court, the law you bring your claim for all your damages, loss of earnings and the replacement cost of everything, is under section 3 of the Torts Act 1977.




waynehoward wrote: He attended May 11th

I have telephoned a couple of help lines who were not very helpful, the info on this site has opened my eyes
The helplines provided by the bailiff companies will be as useful as a wet paper bag. They are allianced with bailiff companies.


waynehoward wrote: I am a small trader on a government start up loan I cant afford to lose this money I am already struggling any help would be appreciated

thanks
Ask the council to return your goods, then file a claim on a form N1 for your replacement cost of all your goods, and your loss of income for each day and continuing until the goods are returned, or until the replacement cost has been paid.

This article gives a summary of the procedure for bringing a claim in the small claims court.
Run this Checklist. If no joy, then we'll fix it
Author: dealingwithbailiffs.co.uk

waynehoward
Posts: 6
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 12:34

#3 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by waynehoward » 11 Jun 2015 20:32

Hi Jason

Thank you very much for your help, he didnt actually take the goods as I paid him the money otherwise I would have been out of business

I will take your advice and pursue it, the bailiff didnt give a shit and wouldnt take anything less than the full amount or the van and goods, it has caused me financial problems but he didnt care

it never entered my head that bailiff companies would have websites set up to miss advise people, one person actually told me that there was nothing I could do, stumbling across your website has been a godsend, I will donate some of the money to the website when I get it returned, I am very grateful for the help and information and I will spread the word across social media

what you are doing is fantastic, most of us dont have much of a clue when it comes to bailiffs and they use that against us, it wont happen to me again

THANK YOU

User avatar
Pote Snitkin
The Watcher
Posts: 6747
Joined: 28 Apr 2014 09:43
Location: In your loft, waiting

#4 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by Pote Snitkin » 11 Jun 2015 20:41

waynehoward wrote:one person actually told me that there was nothing I could do,
Do you recall the username or site you received that advice from?

bagel123
Posts: 3
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 21:19

#5 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by bagel123 » 11 Jun 2015 22:12

Dear Forum members,

at approximatelly 4 pm today a bailiff clamped my delivery vehicle on a public road. I tried to tell the enforcement agent that the vehicle was used solely for work and that he was acting illegally by clamping it. He replied that as the vehicle was worth over £1350 and thus he was within the law. the police were called and under the threat of arrest and blemishing my 100% clean criminal record I reluctantly consented to the car being being towed. reading some of the posts on the forum it looks like that i was well within my rights to state that they were acting unlawfully.
can anyone please help and advise?
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

sammm2k
Posts: 7
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 13:16

#6 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by sammm2k » 14 Jun 2015 00:02

Please Advise. The weekend before last my car was clamped on my drive for pcn. Without going into detail, It was clamped 6.40am, until Monday afternoon after paying £422. I didnt actually see anybody face to face, but the rude, disgusting attitude of the bully who I spoke to on the phone, tried to have me believe it was a different bailiff who clamped my car, even giving two names. The firm he works for, confirmed there was only one bailiff but had used his "middle" name on the removal of goods notice pushed through my door, for security reasons. Turned out his girlfiend live in my close, & he said he didnt want her having any "crap""?????? (how insulting)

I have since phoned Traffic enforcement centre, Northampton, and they confirmed he there is no bailiff registered under either name he used, nor under the company name he was sent from. Although I have a photo of the certificate he showed my daughter, saying he was given his cert in county court May 2015, and signed by a "judge"

I really dont know what to do, I have hardly slept since then,

Please Help

Thank you in advance

User avatar
Hithard
Moderator
Posts: 702
Joined: 19 Mar 2013 13:54

#7 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by Hithard » 14 Jun 2015 16:54

Can you post up the photo of this "Certificate"? If it's false then action can be taken.
if you paid by card and the enforcement action was wrongful then do a chargeback and get your money returned.

Also run the online PCN enforcement & administration compliance check, it may well find other irregularities you can use to revoke enforcement action or even revoke the original PCN itself. http://www.dealingwithbailiffs.co.uk/pcnlegal.html
It will give you a detailed resolution advisory report on you particular case. Let us know what it says.
Descendite ne illegitimi

sammm2k
Posts: 7
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 13:16

#8 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by sammm2k » 14 Jun 2015 18:01

Hithard wrote:Can you post up the photo of this "Certificate"? If it's false then action can be taken.
if you paid by card and the enforcement action was wrongful then do a chargeback and get your money returned.
*-
Also run the online PCN enforcement & administration compliance check, it may well find other irregularities you can use to revoke enforcement action or even revoke the original PCN itself. http://www.dealingwithbailiffs.co.uk/pcnlegal.html
It will give you a detailed resolution advisory report on you particular case. Let us know what it says.
Thank you, I didnt go into to much detail, but I spoke with Cardiff City Council who sent out 2 forms TE9 & TE7 for me to fill in and send to Northampton asap. I have done this already, although I'm bit confused with the process, they said the Enforcement would refund the charges occurred.

Might I also add, the car is disabled class vehicle. My mother is tax excempt, and her tax certificate (indefinate) states im the named driver for that vehicle. When I told the bailiff this, and I said I had all the documents to confirm this, he said he didnt want to see anything unless it was blue badge (my mus has expired). When I said I need access to the vehicle at all times, his reply was "Oh well, you will have to call emergency services then wont you" laughing.

I have attached copy of his certificate
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

sammm2k
Posts: 7
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 13:16

#9 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by sammm2k » 14 Jun 2015 18:12

The REMOVAL NOTICE was not signed in that name, He said he wasnt the bailiff who clamped the car & put notice through my door, he was off (Sunday) and covering for him. When asked what his name was, he wrote it on FINAL NOTICE on the PRINT & SIGNED section, but went on to fill in. my details and the client ref at the same time

User avatar
Pote Snitkin
The Watcher
Posts: 6747
Joined: 28 Apr 2014 09:43
Location: In your loft, waiting

#10 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by Pote Snitkin » 14 Jun 2015 18:52

Thomas is showing as on the register.

The car is exempt from enforcement - the Taking Control of Goods regs 2013 reg 4:
(d)a vehicle on which a valid disabled person’s badge is displayed because it is used for, or in relation to which there are reasonable grounds for believing that it is used for, the carriage of a disabled person;
It doesn't need a blue badge as that is not linked to the car but the person. You showed the bailiff enough evidence of it's permanent use for a disabled person.

You need to contact the council in the morning as they are liable for the bailiff's actions. JasonDWB is the one with the info for claiming your money back.

sammm2k
Posts: 7
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 13:16

#11 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by sammm2k » 14 Jun 2015 20:03

ok thank you. I checked the same list on your site over & over, that why I rang Northampton who had no record of him, Now hw showing on there. So apart from clamping car for 3 days, bullying me, threatening to come in my house and take my belongings & making me nervous wreck, he was within the law to do so, even using false name ?? Now I have to cope with the fact he is few doors down at his girlfriends house on the close I live alone with my 2 children, and I feel totally freaked out

sammm2k
Posts: 7
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 13:16

#12 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by sammm2k » 14 Jun 2015 20:06

do you mind me asking if he recently got his certificate why is the photo not recent and stamped liverpool

User avatar
Pote Snitkin
The Watcher
Posts: 6747
Joined: 28 Apr 2014 09:43
Location: In your loft, waiting

#13 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by Pote Snitkin » 14 Jun 2015 21:23

Just type in 'Marvin' here: http://certificatedbailiffs.justice.gov ... dBailiffs/ and he comes up. That stamp doesn't say Liverpool - the last 3 letters I can see is 'ROL'. I don't know about the photo - is that not what he looked like?
So apart from clamping car for 3 days, bullying me, threatening to come in my house and take my belongings & making me nervous wreck, he was within the law to do so
No, he took a car that was exempt. Do they still have the car? What name was on the removal notice?

I reckon the girlfriend on the street line is BS.

sammm2k
Posts: 7
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 13:16

#14 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by sammm2k » 15 Jun 2015 10:07

Sorry, you said his girlfriend is prob bs?what does bs mean? Also he signed REmoval notice as David Thomas, he said for security reasons. Is it ok for him to do that??

sammm2k
Posts: 7
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 13:16

#15 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by sammm2k » 15 Jun 2015 10:09

I get the bs.... im bit slow at times sorry :)

waynehoward
Posts: 6
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 12:34

#16 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by waynehoward » 20 Jun 2015 17:06

Hi i posted the thread and i am sending a letter to the council before legal action to recover the money the bailiff forced me to to give him, can anyone provide a link please to the law regarding Regulation 4 of the TCGR's 2013. which excempts mu business van entirely so i may cut and paste for my letter

many thanks :)

User avatar
Andy
Moderator
Posts: 1492
Joined: 28 May 2014 17:34

#17 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by Andy » 20 Jun 2015 17:10

2nd Year University Law Student.

waynehoward
Posts: 6
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 12:34

#18 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by waynehoward » 24 Jun 2015 14:18

Thanks Andy however after reading this i am confused




(1) Subject to paragraph (2) and to regulation 5, the following goods of the debtor are exempt goods—

(a)items or equipment (for example, tools, books, telephones, computer equipment and vehicles) which are necessary for use personally by the debtor in the debtor’s employment, business, trade, profession, study or education, except that in any case the aggregate value of the items or equipment to which this exemption is applied shall not exceed £1,350;

what exactly does this mean, is it that is my van and goods are over £1350 then its not exempt ? he took control of my van and stock which was much more than that and said all would be taken away into storage until i paid and i would be charged every day

also in claiming from the council am i allowed to charge for my time in dealing with this and my fuel driving to the council offices

any help through this process would be appreciated and when i get my money back i will donate 10% to the site

thanks

User avatar
Schedule 12
Posts: 13471
Joined: 30 Jul 2012 21:23
Location: Philippines
Contact:

#19 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by Schedule 12 » 24 Jun 2015 14:33

in any case the aggregate value of the items or equipment to which this exemption is applied shall not exceed £1,350;
It means the total on the combined sum of exempt goods is capped at £1350.

As thre bailiff took the van without leaving you with £1350 of other exempt goods, then the taking of the van is unlawful and the council (that issued the PCN) is liable for loss of income and earnings for failure to comply with regulation 4.

You can only recover these in the small claims track. This article gives a summary of the procedure for bringing a claim in the small claims court.. The action is brought under secxtion 3 of the Torts (interference with Goods) Act 1977.

Alternatively, you can deploy pay and reclaim, and that gets you back to work and do a recovery in the small claims court.
Run this Checklist. If no joy, then we'll fix it
Author: dealingwithbailiffs.co.uk

waynehoward
Posts: 6
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 12:34

#20 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by waynehoward » 24 Jun 2015 23:45

thanks for the help printed the article will use to complete my letter to the council and post my progress and result if thats ok

waynehoward
Posts: 6
Joined: 11 Jun 2015 12:34

#21 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by waynehoward » 04 Jul 2015 16:42

Hi I am sending these two letters to the council with regards to the bailiff clamping my van illegally

any feedback on if these are ok would be helpful thanks in advance

2nd July 2015
Dear Sir/Madam
RE PCN number
On the 11th May 2015 a bailiff called to my house, he clamped my business van and took charge of the van and my stock inside informing me that unless I paid him £422 for a PCN the van and the stock would be removed and I would have to pay storage fees and removal fees on top of the bill he claimed already, I was placed under a great deal of pressure to pay.
I felt at the time I had no option but to pay him and I therefore paid him at 4.30pm that day
I now understand that in fact it was illegal for him to clamp my van for the following reasons
1) The van is wholly exempt
2) The business stock is wholly exempt
3) The work tools were wholly exempt
4) I did not receive 7 full days notice and compliance has not been met by the bailiffs

I asked the bailiff what the £75 charge was for and he said for writing to me however I explained I didn’t receive it and his reply was complain to the post office. I have therefore written to Marstons for a tracking number so I am may track the delivery of this letter they charged £75 for because I did not receive it

The Taking Control of Goods Regulations 2013
6.—(1) Subject to paragraph (3), notice of enforcement must be given to the debtor not less than 7 clear days before the enforcement agent takes control of the debtor’s goods.
Method of giving notice and who must give it

8.—(1) Notice of enforcement must be given—

(a)by post addressed to the debtor at the place, or one of the places, where the debtor usually lives or carries on a trade or business;
(b)by fax or other means of electronic communication;
(c)by delivery by hand through the letter box of the place, or one of the places, where the debtor usually lives or carries on a trade or business;
(d)where there is no letterbox, by affixing the notice at or in a place where it is likely to come to the attention of the debtor;
(e)where the debtor is an individual, to the debtor personally; or
(f)where the debtor is not an individual (but is, for example, a company, corporation or partnership), by delivering the notice to—
(i)the place, or one of the places, where the debtor carries on a trade or business; or
(ii)the registered office of the company or partnership.
(2) Notice must be given by the enforcement agent or the enforcement agent’s office
The bailiff informed me that the council had instructed him to just take the van but he did me a favour by clamping it and allowing me a little time to pay. The bailiffs actions in clamping the van and taking control of all my goods were in fact an illegal under the fraud act. I therefore require the name of the person who instructed him to just take my van as I intend to make a complaint to the clerk of the justices in Brighton Magistrates court who have the power to order the Police to investigate and make arrests
The council are wholly responsible for the actions of their agents and I have therefore enclosed a notice before action and if the losses to me are not paid I will take county court action without further delay

AND THE NOTICE BEFORE ACTION AS FOLLOWS

NOTICE BEFORE ACTION
Dear sir/madam
RE: PCN number
On the 11th May a bailiff called to my house and clamped my business van, he would not release it or the stock for my business inside until I paid the full amount he claimed I owed which was £422.
I had to pay the full amount and did so at approx. 4.30pm the same day and therefore lost the use of my van for work for the day
The council is wholly responsible for the acts of their agents and I demand the repayment of money taken from me during an illegal act

The council has 14 days in which to reimburse me with £422 paid to the bailiff a copy of the receipt he made me sign before he would take off the wheel clamp and £50 for loss of use of my van for the day to work. A total of £472

englander
Posts: 2
Joined: 16 Nov 2017 00:29

#22 Re: Did bailiff act illegally

Post by englander » 16 Nov 2017 00:46

With regard to this old thread

Any update ? As I have some interesting info on Marvin but cannot post it in the open & contact from anyone who has been dealt with illegally by him would be useful

Post Reply