Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Quash the Conviction. Revoke the Fees. Claim Damages for Improper Enforcement Action
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Mi55clare
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#1 Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Mi55clare » 24 Jan 2017 17:30

Hi,
Looking for some help on who / what to write to the court and bailiffs to get the matter closed.

I had a court fine for £255, received no notice or chase up from the court. Just a removal notice from Marstons through the door. I have borrowed the money as I can't sleep with the stress of someone breaking in or harassing us & paid the fine via the online court payment service.

I have received a letter back from the court stating a warrant of control issued against my account, they have passed the payment to the bailiffs but the warrant still stands and I have to pay all the enforcement agents costs for carrying out the warrant, from my research I think this is wrong.

I'm looking for some help on who to contact and how to get this resolved, the guy who knocks is super aggressive & has knocked twice while my 15 year old daughter is home alone & really worried here. I'm feeling like a rubbish mum & want to get this sorted asap.

Thanks in advance for any help.
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#2 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Schedule 12 » 24 Jan 2017 18:50

That letter is called a "RETMAR" letter. It gets its name from the tag on the bottom right of the document.



It's a template document sent out when a court fine is paid and a bailiff is annoyed because he is losing out on his fees.

A warrant of control for the recovery of unpaid magistrates;' courts fines is issued under section 76 of the Magistrates Courts Act 1980; which states;
  • Subject to the following provisions of this Part of this Act, and to section 132 below, where default is made in paying a sum adjudged to be paid by a conviction or order of a magistrates’ court, the court may issue a warrant of distress for the purpose of levying the sum or issue a warrant committing the defaulter to prison.
The warrant only confers an enforcement power to recover the sum adjudged.

Bailiffs cannot enforce unpaid fees using the warrant because is only carried an enforcement power to recover the sum adjudged. It does not include the recovery of fees.

Paragraph 6(3) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 states;
  • (3)The property in all goods ceases to be bound when any of these happens—

    • (a)the amount outstanding is paid, out of the proceeds of sale or otherwise;

      (b)the instrument under which the power is exercisable ceases to have effect;

      (c)the power ceases to be exercisable for any other reason.



Paragraph 31 of the Taking Control of Goods: National Standards 2014 states;

  • Enforcement agents must not seek to enforce the recovery of fees where an enforcement power has ceased to be exercisable.



I can't tell you the fees are not owed. I can tell you there is no ENFORCEMENT POWER with the bailiff to recover them by taking control of goods.

If a bailiff threatens you with an enforcement step in respect of the fees, then contact me. We can do something about it.
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Mi55clare
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#3 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Mi55clare » 24 Jan 2017 19:09

jasonDWB wrote:That letter is called a "RETMAR" letter. It gets its name from the tag on the bottom right of the document.



It's a template document sent out when a court fine is paid and a bailiff is annoyed because he is losing out on his fees.

A warrant of control for the recovery of unpaid magistrates;' courts fines is issued under section 76 of the Magistrates Courts Act 1980; which states;
  • Subject to the following provisions of this Part of this Act, and to section 132 below, where default is made in paying a sum adjudged to be paid by a conviction or order of a magistrates’ court, the court may issue a warrant of distress for the purpose of levying the sum or issue a warrant committing the defaulter to prison.
The warrant only confers an enforcement power to recover the sum adjudged.

Bailiffs cannot enforce unpaid fees using the warrant because is only carried an enforcement power to recover the sum adjudged. It does not include the recovery of fees.

Paragraph 6(3) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 states;
  • (3)The property in all goods ceases to be bound when any of these happens—

    • (a)the amount outstanding is paid, out of the proceeds of sale or otherwise;

      (b)the instrument under which the power is exercisable ceases to have effect;

      (c)the power ceases to be exercisable for any other reason.



Paragraph 31 of the Taking Control of Goods: National Standards 2014 states;

  • Enforcement agents must not seek to enforce the recovery of fees where an enforcement power has ceased to be exercisable.



I can't tell you the fees are not owed. I can tell you there is no ENFORCEMENT POWER with the bailiff to recover them by taking control of goods.

If a bailiff threatens you with an enforcement step in respect of the fees, then contact me. We can do something about it.
Thank you Jason, I have had this through the door today - I think implying the fees are lawful & owed.
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#4 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Schedule 12 » 24 Jan 2017 19:37

They are owed, but he cannot enter and search premises, or removed goods.

If the bailiff entered and removed goods then he is liable for an action brought under paragraph 66 of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act (TCEA) 2007 which states;
  • 66(1)This paragraph applies where an enforcement agent—

    • (a)breaches a provision of this Schedule, or

      (b)acts under an enforcement power under a writ, warrant, liability order or other instrument that is defective.


    (2)The breach or defect does not make the enforcement agent, or a person he is acting for, a trespasser.

    (3)But the debtor may bring proceedings under this paragraph.

    (4)Subject to rules of court, the proceedings may be brought—

    • (a)in the High Court, in relation to an enforcement power under a writ of the High Court;

      (b)in the county court, in relation to an enforcement power under a warrant issued by the county court;

      (c)in any other case, in the High Court or the county court.

    (5)In the proceedings the court may

    • (a)order goods to be returned to the debtor;

      (b)order the enforcement agent or a related party to pay damages in respect of loss suffered by the debtor as a result of the breach or of anything done under the defective instrument.

    (6)A related party is either of the following (if different from the enforcement agent)—

    • (a)the person on whom the enforcement power is conferred,

      (b)the creditor.





The provision breached is Paragraph 58(3) of Schedule 12 of the TCEA 2007 which states:
  • Payment of amount outstanding

    58(1)This paragraph applies where the debtor pays the amount outstanding in full

    • (a)after the enforcement agent has taken control of goods, and

      (b)before they are sold or abandoned.


    (2)If the enforcement agent has removed the goods he must as soon as reasonably practicable make them available for collection by the debtor.

    (3)No further step may be taken under the enforcement power concerned.

Using the following template. Give notice to the bailiff, the sum adjudged has been paid. It can be sent by text message to the bailiff to his mobile phone.

Template.
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Mi55clare
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#5 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Mi55clare » 24 Jan 2017 20:38

jasonDWB wrote:They are owed, but he cannot enter and search premises, or removed goods.

If the bailiff entered and removed goods then he is liable for an action brought under paragraph 66 of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act (TCEA) 2007 which states;
  • 66(1)This paragraph applies where an enforcement agent—

    • (a)breaches a provision of this Schedule, or

      (b)acts under an enforcement power under a writ, warrant, liability order or other instrument that is defective.


    (2)The breach or defect does not make the enforcement agent, or a person he is acting for, a trespasser.

    (3)But the debtor may bring proceedings under this paragraph.

    (4)Subject to rules of court, the proceedings may be brought—

    • (a)in the High Court, in relation to an enforcement power under a writ of the High Court;

      (b)in the county court, in relation to an enforcement power under a warrant issued by the county court;

      (c)in any other case, in the High Court or the county court.

    (5)In the proceedings the court may

    • (a)order goods to be returned to the debtor;

      (b)order the enforcement agent or a related party to pay damages in respect of loss suffered by the debtor as a result of the breach or of anything done under the defective instrument.

    (6)A related party is either of the following (if different from the enforcement agent)—

    • (a)the person on whom the enforcement power is conferred,

      (b)the creditor.





The provision breached is Paragraph 58(3) of Schedule 12 of the TCEA 2007 which states:
  • Payment of amount outstanding

    58(1)This paragraph applies where the debtor pays the amount outstanding in full

    • (a)after the enforcement agent has taken control of goods, and

      (b)before they are sold or abandoned.


    (2)If the enforcement agent has removed the goods he must as soon as reasonably practicable make them available for collection by the debtor.

    (3)No further step may be taken under the enforcement power concerned.

Using the following template. Give notice to the bailiff, the sum adjudged has been paid. It can be sent by text message to the bailiff to his mobile phone.

Template.
Hi Jason,

Thank you for your help & explaination of what is and isn't correct. I really appreciate the template letter - will get it sent asap :)

Mi55clare
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#6 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Mi55clare » 25 Jan 2017 08:02

Do I have to send anything to the court?

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#7 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Schedule 12 » 25 Jan 2017 08:38

No.
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Mi55clare
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#8 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Mi55clare » 25 Jan 2017 08:55

I sent the email & text at 8.11 this morning, by 8.30 the bailiff was knocking on the door & posted the following letter through the door. Do I just ignore or is there anything else that needs to be done.

Thank you for your help so far Jason
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#9 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Schedule 12 » 25 Jan 2017 09:10

He will pester you for his £310 kickback. But there is no enforcement power to recover it by taking an enforcement step.

The bailiff only gets £90 commission out of the £310, the rest goes to Marston. They may pressure him to keep pestering. Its all down to how much risk the bailiff is willing to take to get £90 in his pocket.

Many take it on the chin and move on. Other take the risk and invariably have to attend a string of court proceedings which he will never get paid.
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Mi55clare
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#10 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Mi55clare » 25 Jan 2017 12:42

jasonDWB wrote:He will pester you for his £310 kickback. But there is no enforcement power to recover it by taking an enforcement step.

The bailiff only gets £90 commission out of the £310, the rest goes to Marston. They may pressure him to keep pestering. Its all down to how much risk the bailiff is willing to take to get £90 in his pocket.

Many take it on the chin and move on. Other take the risk and invariably have to attend a string of court proceedings which he will never get paid.
Thank you. Great to have a better understanding. Will not be answering the door & hope he's one that takes it on the chin sooner rather than later.

Thank you so much for the guidance.

Mi55clare
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#11 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Mi55clare » 30 Jan 2017 15:35

jasonDWB wrote:
25 Jan 2017 09:10
He will pester you for his £310 kickback. But there is no enforcement power to recover it by taking an enforcement step.

The bailiff only gets £90 commission out of the £310, the rest goes to Marston. They may pressure him to keep pestering. Its all down to how much risk the bailiff is willing to take to get £90 in his pocket.

Many take it on the chin and move on. Other take the risk and invariably have to attend a string of court proceedings which he will never get paid.
Hi Jason,

The bailiff is still knocking / leaving letters for his fees. Is the advice just to ignore. I text him a copy of the letter emailed and posted to Marstons

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#12 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Schedule 12 » 30 Jan 2017 16:21

That is all he can do. Keep the chain on the door and your car safe.

http://www.dealingwithbailiffs.co.uk/Ex ... liffs.html

He'll eventually move on.
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#13 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by jaja » 24 May 2017 12:18

Hi Mi55clare,

Can you share your current situation?

Did Marston's back off?
I'm in a similar situation and it would be very helpful to know.

Thank you

J

Mi55clare
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#14 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by Mi55clare » 25 May 2017 07:19

jaja wrote:
24 May 2017 12:18
Hi Mi55clare,

Can you share your current situation?

Did Marston's back off?
I'm in a similar situation and it would be very helpful to know.

Thank you

J
Hi J,

Eventually it has stopped!

The bailiff or Marstons never replied to my letter or text message. He continued to harass me for weeks with sticking threatening letters to my front door or posting them through - about overdue money, time limit to pay, getting a lock smith & increased costs. I did as was told & ignored but it was very stressful.

If you've paid the court & followed the good advice above just be vigilant, careful and ride it out - good luck.

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#15 Re: Marstons help, have paid fine to court

Post by jaja » 25 May 2017 23:55

Hi Mi55 clare,

Thats good to know, thank you for replying.

Good luck!

J

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