Marston Bailiff towed away my car

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web2018
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Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by web2018 » 29 Mar 2018 14:44

Hi,

Really need advice from this forum. I had a court fine £232. Case was passed to bailiffs and had a visit from enforcement officer. I didn't answer the door, he left the letter with intention to revisit. I contacted the court and explained I am financially struggling. They advised because case is with bailiffs they can't do anything.

After reading online, I decided to pay the fine online direct to the court to avoid bailiff charges. On 28th March 2018 paid the full outstanding fine and sent copy of receipt to bailiffs and court. I also mentioned to bailiffs that I am not obliged to deal with them and once the fine has been paid they have no legal power to execute any warrant they had.

HMCT court officer replied back saying any money you have paid will be forwarded to the bailiffs. They will deduct their charges and will still chase you for remaining balance.

This morning on 29th March had a visit from Bailiff at around 7am. Didn't answer the door. he left without any netter but returned at 11 with truck to tow away the car. when challenged he demanded £652. I said I have already paid £232 direct to the court. Hesaif you have to pay £652 and will later get refund of what you have paid to the court. He took the car away.

Can anyone please advise how to deal with this now? I followed the instructions from the posts on this forum mentioning that once the original debt is paid bailiffs have no legal power to remove goods. Please help.

web2018
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by web2018 » 29 Mar 2018 16:59

Any advice please? Its long weekend now while my car is still with them. Enforcement agent did not leave information on storage location. Thank you.

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 29 Mar 2018 17:36

The bailiff took an enforcement step after the enforcement power had ceased. That is a breach of paragraph 6(3) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 (TCEA 2007).

As you are no longer a debtor, you cannot bring an action under paragraph 66 of Schedule 12 of the TCEA 2007, instead, you have to bring it under section 3 of the Torts (Interference with Goods) Act 1977. This is because you ceased being a "debtor" for the purpose of Schedule 12 when the fine was paid.

The action is brought on a form N16a at your home county court (not a magistrates court), make a witness statement proving the amount you were fined and the date you got a receipt for payment of the fine.

Provided the receipt pre-dates the time the car was taken, you have a clean case.

Once you have your car back, you can sue for damages for loss of use of the car, plus any damages caused to it. But - you must give notice of the damage as soon as the car is returned to the bailiff company, otherwise, the damage can be attributed to you. The action is brought separately because paragraph 35 of Schedule 12 of the TCEA 2007 makes the enforcement agent ant his company liable for the care of controlled goods until they cease to be controlled.

You can also recover all the money taken, but if you haven't paid the bailiff, then you might want to consider "Pay and Reclaim". This procedure is highly toxic for the bailiff company because this action is brought in the small claims track and the bailiff company has no prospect of ever recovering their solicitors fees no matter how the proceedings pan out. The bailiff company always loses with a "pay & reclaim" action, Hence why such a case becomes toxic for the bailiff company.

I wouldn't worry about the length of time the car is with the bailiff company, you get about £75 a day for the deprivation of use. Use it to rack up a claim, or you can apply for an interlocutory relief under section 4 and get the car back straight away.

If no paperwork was given when the car was taken, then you can claim damages for breach of statutory duty by failing to give a notice after entry(sic), akin to bringing a remedy for a drive-by clamping when a car registration with unpaid tickets is found on the street by a kerb-crawler.

Even if you decide to use Pay & Reclaim, you can still sue the bailiff company for damages to the car, provided that damage was not there before it was taken, The bailiff will have videoed himself using a body-work video camera while taking control of the car. This will decide whether the damage claimed is pre-existing. If the bailiff refuses to make over his body-work video footage, his defence is defeated.

If you want to start the show, then contact me for an initial telephone consultation and I can go over the options open for you and explain the legal position. The evidence I need is:
  • 1. The amount you were fined
    2. Date you paid it to court (receipt)
    3. Date the car was taken
    4. Amount demanded by the bailiff - fine and fees.
My contact details are in my email signature beneath this post.
I am a paralegal working for solicitors bringing proceedings against bailiffs for non-compliant enforcement action.

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web2018
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by web2018 » 29 Mar 2018 20:55

Thank you for your reply. I paid the original court fine online yesterday 28th March in the morning and emailed Marston that original debt has been paid. Also emailed court staff saying fine paid and I dont intend to pay bailiff charges. To that court staff emailedme saying i still have to pay bailiff charges.

No reply from Marston until this morning enforcement agent came to tow xar away. He asked for £652 including original court fine despite me telling him this was paid yesterday. He left notice of goods collected for removal but didn't leave information on where they are taking my car.

My wife was at home alone to deal with this and got so upset she couldn't take care of 3 under 2 children at home. As result my son age 2 banged his head on the stairs with lots of bleeding. I am currently at A&E for stiches to wound.

I need your help to start the process. Let me know how i contact you.

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 29 Mar 2018 22:22

Please post any paperwork you have relating to this matter.

Obviously redacted versions.

Can you also point us to the advice online that you followed.

Thanks.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by web2018 » 30 Mar 2018 01:37

Schedule 12 wrote:
29 Mar 2018 17:36
The bailiff took an enforcement step after the enforcement power had ceased. That is a breach of paragraph 6(3) of Schedule 12 of the Tribunals Courts and Enforcement Act 2007 (TCEA 2007).

As you are no longer a debtor, you cannot bring an action under paragraph 66 of Schedule 12 of the TCEA 2007, instead, you have to bring it under section 3 of the Torts (Interference with Goods) Act 1977. This is because you ceased being a "debtor" for the purpose of Schedule 12 when the fine was paid.

The action is brought on a form N16a at your home county court (not a magistrates court), make a witness statement proving the amount you were fined and the date you got a receipt for payment of the fine.

Provided the receipt pre-dates the time the car was taken, you have a clean case.

Once you have your car back, you can sue for damages for loss of use of the car, plus any damages caused to it. But - you must give notice of the damage as soon as the car is returned to the bailiff company, otherwise, the damage can be attributed to you. The action is brought separately because paragraph 35 of Schedule 12 of the TCEA 2007 makes the enforcement agent ant his company liable for the care of controlled goods until they cease to be controlled.

You can also recover all the money taken, but if you haven't paid the bailiff, then you might want to consider "Pay and Reclaim". This procedure is highly toxic for the bailiff company because this action is brought in the small claims track and the bailiff company has no prospect of ever recovering their solicitors fees no matter how the proceedings pan out. The bailiff company always loses with a "pay & reclaim" action, Hence why such a case becomes toxic for the bailiff company.

I wouldn't worry about the length of time the car is with the bailiff company, you get about £75 a day for the deprivation of use. Use it to rack up a claim, or you can apply for an interlocutory relief under section 4 and get the car back straight away.

If no paperwork was given when the car was taken, then you can claim damages for breach of statutory duty by failing to give a notice after entry(sic), akin to bringing a remedy for a drive-by clamping when a car registration with unpaid tickets is found on the street by a kerb-crawler.

Even if you decide to use Pay & Reclaim, you can still sue the bailiff company for damages to the car, provided that damage was not there before it was taken, The bailiff will have videoed himself using a body-work video camera while taking control of the car. This will decide whether the damage claimed is pre-existing. If the bailiff refuses to make over his body-work video footage, his defence is defeated.

If you want to start the show, then contact me for an initial telephone consultation and I can go over the options open for you and explain the legal position. The evidence I need is:
  • 1. The amount you were fined
    2. Date you paid it to court (receipt)
    3. Date the car was taken
    4. Amount demanded by the bailiff - fine and fees.
My contact details are in my email signature beneath this post.
Please check your message. I have sent you requested information. Thanks.

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 30 Mar 2018 10:56

If the injury is a result of the enforcement agent, then you can make a personal injury claim.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Syd Snitkin » 30 Mar 2018 11:52

I think it happened quite a while after he left.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 30 Mar 2018 13:07

Pote Snitkin wrote:
30 Mar 2018 11:52
I think it happened quite a while after he left.
Yes - Given that he was in A&E at 9 o clock last night and the bailiff arrived at 11 in the morning. I think it's a bit far fetched to suggest the bailiff action caused the wife such upset that she couldn't take care of her own children, hours after the event.

I think there's more chance of winning tonights Euromillions than there is succeeding with a personal injury claim.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 30 Mar 2018 17:22

The Client can make up his own mind what he chooses to pursue.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 30 Mar 2018 17:57

Schedule 12 wrote:
30 Mar 2018 17:22
The Client can make up his own mind what he chooses to pursue.
Well he hasn't has much success doing so thus far has he?
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 31 Mar 2018 06:04

He has not had his consultation yet.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 31 Mar 2018 10:35

Jason:

1. You have never once, despite continued requests, provided a shred of evidence that you have ever succeeded in a claim when a bailiff took a step after the debtor has paid the court directly (minus bailiff fees). This case is just another in a long line of examples where we have seen debtors loose goods and/or end up with more fees because they thought that there was a loophole to get out of paying bailiff fees.

2. Even if there was a breach of Schedule 12, that breach would not make the bailiff a trespasser.

3. Even if the bailiff was deemed a trespasser and there was a breach of Schedule 12 (which I don't think there has been), that doesn't make it possible to claim for every mishap that occurs thereafter. A child going to A&E hours after a bailiff visited cannot be attributed to that visit.

You are now going to charge someone for a consultation whereby you recommend issuing proceedings for wrongful taking of the car and separate proceedings for personal injury. Both claims are doomed to fail and would expose the OP to potential costs orders imposed from strike out hearings. Even if they were allowed to proceed, how much time and money would be wasted on them before they eventually fail?

In this case, the OP (if genuine) has a decent shout at getting the £110 sale fee removed but has no chance of any other fees being removed. Your policy of "sue on sight" is so silly, I could imagine a comedy sketch being made based around it.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by web2018 » 02 Apr 2018 14:48

I hope Jason can help, my car is still with bailiff. I followed advice from this board that if I pay original fine bailiff charges won't need to be paid. I need to get my car back. Already paid £232 out of £652 including tow away charges. For this amount don't want them to sale car worth around £3000.

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 02 Apr 2018 15:21

You can call me now. I was live on TalkRADIO just now, and just completed my live interview about bailiffs and the MOJ crackdown on bailiff conduct.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 02 Apr 2018 15:40

web2018 wrote:
02 Apr 2018 14:48
I hope Jason can help, my car is still with bailiff. I followed advice from this board that if I pay original fine bailiff charges won't need to be paid. I need to get my car back. Already paid £232 out of £652 including tow away charges. For this amount don't want them to sale car worth around £3000.
I can help.

Pay the fcukin money. The longer you leave it, the more it is going to cost you as storage fees are added on a daily basis.

There is no loophole and no way out of this. If you really decided to go down this road based on reading an internet forum then more the fool you. If it were that easy, there would be no incentive to pay court fines would there? Everyone would simply wait till bailiffs called before paying.

Once you get the car back, there is a chance that we can get you £110 back but the longer you leave it, the less chance there is of doing so.

That is if you're genuine of course. We get these type of posts on a regular basis and every time people are asked to post redacted documents, they never do so - Just like you haven't Mr web man.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Syd Snitkin » 02 Apr 2018 16:06

I thought a consultation was paid for?
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 02 Apr 2018 16:48

He will do a pay & reclaim.

He mentioned there are no published successful fee recovery claims on the internet.

The reason is Marston nearly always settle before the hearing date. The claims they miss are attempted after the judgment is made and try to defend them retrospectively.

There are about half a dozen such cases in progress at the moment. Marston has NEVER defeated a fee recovery claim at court.

A fee recovery claim is a paid-up court fine (amount outstanding) is paid, the bailiff takes control of goods to obtain unpaid fees and the debtor reclaims it through the courts.

The other remedy is a section 3 injunction, but the value of the fine and fees makes an injunction a comparatively expensive option. Injunctions are good if the bailiff demands a high sum to give the car back.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by web2018 » 02 Apr 2018 17:54

Don't know why there is doubt on my post whether it is genuine or not. Never thought purpose of this forum could be for people to make money from those who are already struggling with finances hence ended up with bailiff.

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 02 Apr 2018 18:10

This forum provides free advice for people with bailiff problems. It is financially subsidised and does not carry sponsored ads.

It exists because bailiff companies take over user groups pretending to help people in debt when the bailiff company is actually helping themselves.

There was never any doubt as to the integrity of your inquiry. It's something we come across a lot. Individuals on the internet pretend to offer help when they are actually helping the bailiff company. These individuals either know they are out to deceive, or they are naive and get suckered by a bailiff company into helping them. When they are caught, they start flame wars and much more:

One example of an individual that got suckered by a bailiff company is this:

https://www.bloomberg.com/research/stoc ... d=44793571
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 02 Apr 2018 18:24

web2018 wrote:
02 Apr 2018 17:54
Don't know why there is doubt on my post whether it is genuine or not. Never thought purpose of this forum could be for people to make money from those who are already struggling with finances hence ended up with bailiff.
Now hold on a minute Web man.

You claim that you were struggling with finances but hey presto, the minute the bailiff gets involved, you miraculously find the money to pay. It is clear that the bailiff involvement has enticed you to pay. Had the bailiff not been involved, the fine would still remain unpaid wouldn't it? This is a two way thing, you can't have it both ways. You wouldn't do work for nothing so why expect the bailiff to?

As for free help, for the final time, this is your ONLY option:

1. Pay what the bailiffs are demanding asap. If you don't, the costs will rise through storage charges.

2. If you believe that you have been wronged, you have the opportunity to start court action at a later date. (which I strongly recommend that you don't)

3. Once you have your car back, come back and we'll try to get £110 of what you paid refunded.

Remember, I asked you to post up redacted paperwork last week in order to give you free help but you chose to ignore me. How can we possibly help you when you are not helping yourself?
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 02 Apr 2018 19:05

At the compound, remember to make a walk-a-round video of the car and take close-ups of any knocks and dings.

You take stills and give them in evidence.

The bailiff can only defend the claim if he produces his bodycam footage.

The route I go down is asking for the footage first and exhibit a copy of their excuse letter. That makes any subsequent footage produced in their defence inadmissible. They can't rely on evidence they previously said was unavailable.

You can recover the cost of repairs and a rental car during repairs in a section 3 of the Torts Act claim. It is a breach of Paragraph 35 of Schedule 12 of the TCEA 2007.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by web2018 » 02 Apr 2018 20:21

John The Baptist wrote:
02 Apr 2018 18:24
web2018 wrote:
02 Apr 2018 17:54
Don't know why there is doubt on my post whether it is genuine or not. Never thought purpose of this forum could be for people to make money from those who are already struggling with finances hence ended up with bailiff.
Now hold on a minute Web man.

You claim that you were struggling with finances but hey presto, the minute the bailiff gets involved, you miraculously find the money to pay. It is clear that the bailiff involvement has enticed you to pay. Had the bailiff not been involved, the fine would still remain unpaid wouldn't it? This is a two way thing, you can't have it both ways. You wouldn't do work for nothing so why expect the bailiff to?

As for free help, for the final time, this is your ONLY option:

1. Pay what the bailiffs are demanding asap. If you don't, the costs will rise through storage charges.

2. If you believe that you have been wronged, you have the opportunity to start court action at a later date. (which I strongly recommend that you don't)

3. Once you have your car back, come back and we'll try to get £110 of what you paid refunded.

Remember, I asked you to post up redacted paperwork last week in order to give you free help but you chose to ignore me. How can we possibly help you when you are not helping yourself?
Sorry, to me it sounds like you are defending baillfs. Yes, I am struggling with finances but after reading posts on this forum , it appeared to me if I raise money to pay the original debt, bailiff will have no legal power to remove goods.

So please stop challenging me if you have nothing positive to contribute.

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 02 Apr 2018 20:29

I'm not defending bailiffs, I give my advice for free as you are asking. I challenge bailiffs when they do wrong, not some pipe dream about suing them for tort and personal injury and then injuncting them.

As for having nothing positive to contribute, I've told you the position. There 0% chance that you are going to avoid bailiff fees so forget about any notions of doing so. The bailiff does have a legal power to remove goods and he has done so.

You haven't got much right so far, it's up to you what you do from here onwards
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 02 Apr 2018 20:45

If you pay fees without an amount outstanding (as it is defined by law, para. 50.3 of Schedule 12) without the bailiff taking control of goods, you have no possibility of ever recovering them.

There is a case that says fees paid under the threat of taking a car may not be recovered because the bailiff said the payment is "voluntary".

The moment a bailiff takes control of goods, clamps a car, or removes a car, then his goose is cooked. The victim can sue.

If a bailiff clamps a car, the bailiff company only pays the money taken plus costs.

If a bailiff removes a car, then its called "special damages". These are usually into several thousand pounds and the bailiff has to swallow the costs.

Special Damages include the daily rate for the loss of the car. All money taken, repairs to the car while under the bailiff's control, daily rate rental car, vehicle transport from compound to owner, all court fees plus litigants CPR46.5. It racks up a big bill.

Bailiff companies try breaking the rules to see if they can escape paying out damages. By example, a bailiff company deliberately breaking rules to see if they can make a profit is Newlyn Plc. Their policy to clamp cars on Hire Purchase and defending the injunction on the basis the hirer has a beneficial interest at first, succeeded. When injunction cases were brought by solicitors, it landed Newlyn Plc a very expensive lesson. Newlyn Plc then changed its policy on clamping hire purchase goods, and that is thanks to this board.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 02 Apr 2018 21:23

Jason - It is your opinion that the amount outstanding only includes the original fine. You rely on an Act of Parliment from 1980. A court has found that the amount outstanding does indeed include bailiff fees AS WELL as the original fine. This was by way of an Act of Parliment from 2007.

You should also be aware that a court is almost certain to rule that there was no need for a "big bill". If a car is taken (as in this case), are you seriously suggesting that a debtor should not pay £600 odd to get the car released (pay and reclaim) but instead, pay thousands to hire a car? Are you aware of the overriding objective in civil litigation?

As for Newlyn and HP, yes, they changed it's policy thanks to this board but also, let's not forget that the original case that you mention succeeded (or failed from our point of view) also thanks to this board (or to be more accurate, thanks to you). The debtor ended up with a needless costs bill of £3,000 because you advised him to take Newlyn to court when it would have been quicker, simpler and risk free to just produce evidence that there was no beneficial interest in the car (regardless of the rights and wrongs of the beneficial interest argument)

I really struggle to grasp what your obsession is about taking bailiff companies to court? It is almost childlike, as if it is some kind of game.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 03 Apr 2018 07:01

John The Baptist wrote:
02 Apr 2018 21:23
Jason - It is your opinion that the amount outstanding only includes the original fine. You rely on an Act of Parliment from 1980.
I reply on an Act of Parliament from 2007.



A court has found that the amount outstanding does indeed include bailiff fees AS WELL as the original fine. This was by way of an Act of Parliment from 2007.
The 2007 Act defines amount outstanding in Paragraph 50(3) of Schedule 12. There is no mention of fees. Only costs.

Fees and Costs are two distinctly separate things each with their own dictionary definition. The term "enforcement" has its own definition in Section 62 of the TCEA 2007.




You should also be aware that a court is almost certain to rule that there was no need for a "big bill". If a car is taken (as in this case), are you seriously suggesting that a debtor should not pay £600
I've recommended pay and reclaim. That is to pay the demand and get control of the car. Then he can recover money taken plus damage caused to the car while under the bailiff's control. This means taking a walk-a-round video of the car closing in on all knocks dents and dings. The cost of repair is recoverable provided the bailiff's body cam footage does not prove the contrary.

The client's argument was, why was he not advised to pay the fees when demanded. Two reasons.
  • He approached us after the car was taken, see his thread title.

    By paying the fees, amounts to voluntary payment and he cannot recover them. He can only recover them if the bailiffs take control of goods.


odd to get the car released (pay and reclaim) but instead, pay thousands to hire a car?
These are called Special Damages. The claimant has to prove a loss. Car rental receipts and repair bills for damage to the car that was not there when the bailiff took control of it, are all Special Damages.

Bailiffs are liable for the care of controlled goods under Paragraph 35 of Schedule 12 of the TCEA 2007.



Are you aware of the overriding objective in civil litigation?
The claim and costs must be proportionate. If the client can prove a loss, he can recover it. In Part 27 claims, the costs are fixed by the Court.

I have no control over what the solicitor passes on to the defendant bailiff company or creditor as costs.



As for Newlyn and HP, yes, they changed it's policy thanks to this board but also, let's not forget that the original case that you mention succeeded (or failed from our point of view) also thanks to this board (or to be more accurate, thanks to you). The debtor ended up with a needless costs bill of £3,000 because you advised him to take Newlyn to court
I didn't advise him to take Newlyn to court. Someone else did. I followed that advice.

The debtor got a £3000 bill, but Newlyn since got much bigger one. One claim by itself left Newlyn small-change of £30K partly because the vehicle was written off and the debtor had to be given a new one, (albeit still on HP).





when it would have been quicker, simpler and risk free to just produce evidence that there was no beneficial interest in the car
He did precisely that. Newlyn rejected it. Their solicitor opined the hirer had beneficial interest.

Their solicitor vigourously fought that argument tooth and nail at court. I was there.



(regardless of the rights and wrongs of the beneficial interest argument)

I really struggle to grasp what your obsession is about taking bailiff companies to court? It is almost childlike, as if it is some kind of game.
Bailiff companies treat a letter before action as a "complaint".

Until proceedings are filed, the bailiff company will give an endless volley of correspondence fobbing off the claimant with excuses. Once the LBA lapses and the money is not in the client's bank account, the proceedings start. This is the only way to redress a bailiff problem with the least amount of work.

All non-part 27 claims are now done by solicitors. - Unless the client chooses to do it themselves, or have their own choice solicitor.

I do not bring the proceedings, I simply give the client the options which they can make a choice. If the client chooses me, I prepare the witness statement, the skeleton argument, part-completed court forms (solicitor signs them) along with a summary of the case. I bundle it all up and pass it to a solicitor. At that point, the client leaves my jurisdiction. It is the solicitor that decides whether the client has a case and how the case progresses.


Part 27 claims are small claims track. It gives protection from the costs of the bailiff company and a simple procedure to recover money. It takes a maximum of 12 weeks and sets a clear roadmap form the client to get his money back. Most Part 27's are settled before the hearing date and the money is in the client's bank account. The bailiff company doesn't want to shell out on sending a solicitor into the small claims track. Therefore, I choose this route over a bailiff company complaints procedure.

I really struggle to grasp what your obsession is about taking bailiff companies to court?
Two reasons I don't have an "obsession" with taking bailiff companies to court.
  • Legal proceedings make money. DWB is a commercial business bringing redress for unlawful bailiff action.

    Bailiff companies learn very quickly when they are hit in the pocket
This is why my policy is favoured by the MOJ in its latest crackdown on enforcement malpractice. It was quick to state that it only targets individual bailiffs that "overstep the mark". Not the companies themselves.

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... rm-web.pdf
I am a paralegal working for solicitors bringing proceedings against bailiffs for non-compliant enforcement action.

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John The Baptist
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 03 Apr 2018 09:57

I reply on an Act of Parliament from 2007.
Well it's a pity that a judge didn't share your opinion then.

The 2007 Act defines amount outstanding in Paragraph 50(3) of Schedule 12. There is no mention of fees. Only costs.
The Act defines the amount outstanding to be the amount of the debt PLUS costs of enforcement related services. I think it's a pretty safe bet that a bailiff enforcing a debt is an enforcement related service don't you? If further explanation is required, the Act tells you that "enforcement related services" is anything that is recoverable from proceeds. Bailiff fees are recoverable from proceeds. The reason "costs" has been used instead of "fees" is because enforcement related services consist of fees PLUS costs such as locksmiths, storage, auction fees etc.

I've recommended pay and reclaim
Well eventually yes. Originally, you told the OP to fill out an N16a form (injunction)

That is to pay the demand and get control of the car
So no big bill after all then? No car hire fees, no nothing except if there is damage to the car. That isn't what you said before.

The client's argument was, why was he not advised to pay the fees when demanded
Advised by who? You tell people to pay online via an automated service. As far as that service is concerned, part payment has been made. The correct procedure would be for the creditor to inform the bailiff that part payment has been made (or as courts do, pass the money over to the bailiffs to administer)

These are called Special Damages
Damages are damages are damages. They only need be identified if different types of damages are being claimed ie exemplary damages, aggravated damages etc.

I didn't advise him to take Newlyn to court. Someone else did.
You sold him a pack for £99 and sent him off to court.

He did precisely that.
No he didn't. The reason for his downfall in court (if I recall correctly) was because he had not submitted any exhibits showing tat there was no beneficial interest.

Their solicitor vigourously fought that argument tooth and nail at court. I was there.
No you weren't - That's why the solicitor released all his venom about you to the poor debtor on the way out instead of on you. You know the solicitor in question is obsessed with this forum and reads it 24/7 why give him the satisfaction of seeing you tell such baltant lies?

Part 27 claims are small claims track
So any money spent on a solicitor is dead money then that can't be recovered? This is on top of any monies paid to you.

DWB is a commercial business bringing redress for unlawful bailiff action.
It may well be a commercial business and it may well be that there is money to be made from legal proceedings. I'm not interested in that. I give my advice for free and am only concerned with helping people online. To suggest that someone sues for personal injury because his son went to A&E is bordering on insanity - UNLESS you just want to enhance the profits of your commercial business? Just because you make money out of civil action doesn't mean you should recommend it for even the most ridiculous of matters.

This is why my policy is favoured by the MOJ in its latest crackdown on enforcement malpractice
"Favoured"? Have you read the last 2 paragraphs of section 4.1????????

You've been asked several times before to try this idea of paying a court directly yourself. You never have done though have you? Surely you doing it is all the evidence anyone ever needs to have confidence that it works?

Here's another idea. If you are so confident in these claims working, why don't you do your work on a no win no fee basis?
Dodgeball on committal for council tax being a coercive measure - "FMOTL nonsense". Discuss

John The Baptist
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by John The Baptist » 03 Apr 2018 10:18

From the link to the MOJ "crackdown"
4.7.3. Direct payment of debt
One issue raised by enforcement agents is that debtors are sometimes erroneously
advised (mainly by informal online sources) to pay their creditor directly after receiving
notice that the enforcement process has begun, in an attempt to avoid the enforcement
fees. In this situation, the creditor is supposed to pay the compliance fee to the
enforcement agent out of the debtor’s payment and the shortfall remains outstanding. If
the debt has reached the enforcement stage it becomes more complicated as the
enforcement fee is paid pro rata from the amount paid off. This leads to an administrative
burden on the Local Authority as they have to separate the fees and a portion of the debt
still remains requiring enforcement.
Although the simple solution to this problem would be to reject direct payments, many
Local Authorities have systems that do not allow a payment to be rejected, particularly
when the debt is paid online. Some have said that the extra burden of dealing with this
has equated to a full time member of staff.
Dodgeball on committal for council tax being a coercive measure - "FMOTL nonsense". Discuss

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 03 Apr 2018 10:38

That needs to be on separate thread for discussion. Ill give my reply on it.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Syd Snitkin » 03 Apr 2018 13:12

Proper evidence that the procedure works will put the matter to bed. Been asking for some time now.
Dodgeball on the Criminal Procedure Rules - "FMOTL nonsense". Discuss.

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 03 Apr 2018 15:33

No you weren't - That's why the solicitor released all his venom about you to the poor debtor on the way out instead of on you. You know the solicitor in question is obsessed with this forum and reads it 24/7 why give him the satisfaction of seeing you tell such baltant lies?
I'm not talking about Reiss.

I was present at DJ Wulwik as was PF when he delivered his speech about beneficial interest.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 03 Apr 2018 15:35

So any money spent on a solicitor is dead money then that can't be recovered? This is on top of any monies paid to you.
The client cannot get solicitors fees in Part 27, but he has his disbursements paid under CPR 46.5.
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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by web2018 » 03 Apr 2018 16:19

Update on my case, I have contacted Marston and Collectica to find out where have they taken my car to. They said i need to speak with enforcement agent. Enforcement agent not answering my call or text messages.

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Re: Marston Bailiff towed away my car

Post by Schedule 12 » 03 Apr 2018 16:50

It most probably at
  • PLOT 2, HARBET ROAD
    EDMONTON
    N18 3HQ

Call them on Marston Goods Removed 01992 572200

If they get funny with you then consider an injunction. Their notice fails on Paragraph 34(4) of Schedule 12 because it does not give the address they took the vehicle, and the cost of storage is missing.
I am a paralegal working for solicitors bringing proceedings against bailiffs for non-compliant enforcement action.

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